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 Post subject: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 7:04 am 
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Well, since the MOTD asked us to supply feedback, I thought I'd give it a shot. Keep in mind this is my opinion and would like a civil discussion on it.

I see that magic containers got changed and you want to do scheduled purges of equipment in order to cycle unused equipment back into the game.

While it is a start, I mostly see it as dealing with the symptoms instead of the root of the issues. Especially if people can hold two containers, one in each hand and even more if they have wearable equpment that can hold additional items (cloak of holding, belt of many pockets, knapsack, just to name a few).

But the question is, why would people want to hold that many items they never use? I think the answer consists of several parts.

First reason: They can. They worked for it, they found the load. Got it and claim it as their own. Fair game. I see no issue with this part, personally.

Second reason: It is a rare and limited ressource. They hold on to it, because it is limited in quantity, powerful and has value in possible trades. And this is where I see the issue.

To elaborate on that let us take Amhearst's gear as an example. People in the high ranks will likely agree that gear from him is among the best in the entire game.

His axe. Decapitator, is highly sought after but unique, and his other items, like the battle scarred armbands or bone monocles are extremely powerful, but also limited in quantity due to the "item maxing system". This goes for several other extremely powerful in the game that also come with a certain kind of prestige.

Now if we have an extremely small player base, around 10-12 active people, there are no issues, since everyone can have mostly everything, except the unique items. However, since it has been stated that it is in the games best interest to have a bigger and more active player base, I do see an issue with this system.

This game is a grind and the grind is for experience a.k.a. player levels and gear. Everyone can grind experience, while the efficiency of that process is dictated by gear and partly player class. From my experience, most people tie the fun they have in the game to loading items and accumulating more. However, the previously mentioned "item max" limits the progress all people can make.

Most of the most powerful items are held by very few of the people in the player base, and those that missed out, have no chance of getting them ever again. I personally think that is a major issue, especially for new people, when they realise that they will never be able to get as powerful as those who are already up there.

While one now may argue that there are other sources of fun in the game, other goals, I would definitely like to agree. There is /should be RP, hanging out with buddies and having a good time playing the game. From my experience however, it is mostly sitting around alone, hoping for the item to pop so that you can claim it as your own. Judging from what people have in their bags and houses, I can only assume that is true for mostly everybody. And since you are now thinking about item purges in order to cycle more gear back into the game, I can only assume you (the staff) see it as an issue as well.

I would propose a different solution. You guessed it, remove the "item max" restrictions. Most items have a horribly low load rate anyway (looking at you here, majestic unicorn) and take weeks to load. Now add to it, that those items would need to be shared among others, you will see that most people prefer to do it alone. At least from what I can see and most avatars running around alone, camping mindlessly to gain that little bit of extra power.

Removing "item max" would remove that issue, in my opinion anyway. So you missed an item when playing with your friends, who cares, youll just get the next one. No more need to hold on to an abundance of extra equipment. If you lose yours, you can just get it again and you can share with people freely, never having to "worry" about handing out something you might not be able to replace later. Leave the load rates low as they are, just enable everyone to get the items. Now if you want to be "unique", we could still encourage restrings, people creating extra items via RPs, empowering them with their stories or new mechanics ingame (?).

As I said earlier, of course there should be other sources of fun in the game than mundane item camping. Myself, I am a huge fan of Roleplaying, but as most of you -might- agree, there hardly ever is any RP. And if it is, it is, well, limited to killing stuff or each other, or just talking. Of course it is up to the players themselves to flesh out their RP, most don't bother or even dislike it.

As I stated earlier, this post is based on my experience and opinions and I would love to hear feedback or even some number crunching from Nezmar on that. I have nothing but anecdotal reference and no empiric proof, so maybe I am rambling about something that got changed some time ago and I just didnt notice.

However, since there seems to be the need to cycle gear with the current system, I assume the issue is on-going. Why not erase the need to hold on to extra equipment in this manner, and not just treat the symptoms?

Please discuss, I am curious what others have to say on it.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 11:55 am 
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I would have to agree with the idea of removing maxx on items as it was a few years ago. It creates an atmosphere where people want to play alone cause they want that super unique item. But what if everyone could get it? There would be no reason to hoard anything. I also agree load rates as a whole are pretty low, and it can get discouraging farming things over countless hours for no reward. Right now we have a group experience bonus which is very nice, and we should think of further ways to facilitate group play. I think it would be worth a look at the requirement of being half of someones level in order to group with them, perhaps 1/3 of their level or no restriction at all.

Looking forward to whatever changes are coming , thanks for all the hard work Nez


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Mon Jun 18, 2018 9:12 pm 
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I would argue that the items and the load rates aren't the real problem. The real problem, if there is one, are the players. The item max has been here over various iterations and largely isn't even a problem anymore. Back when there weren't nearly as many items as there are now and way more players, sure. It was harder for new players to get up into the higher tiers (but not impossible). I mean, what's out there (that isn't unique) that can't be loaded by someone that can actually use it?

I'm cool with making containers hold less, etc. The only reason I really see to hold on to that much stuff is a) to have different sets of gear for different purposes (like for regen, or support, or what have you) or b) waiting for stuff to kick in due to level requirements and the like. It made me realize how much junk I've been holding on to with the intent of giving it away. So instead I just consigned it all. Win/win.

:)


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 8:49 pm 
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Several years ago we made an attempt to address the issue you've brought up. In the end, we tried to compromise... we have what we have called "soft limits". Item limits are based upon the total number of player characters. If we had more players, we'd have more "unique" items. This may need some adjustment (though I tend to believe we just need more players), but I think the concept is sound. The adjustments can be made item by item. If everyone gets their friends to play, there will be more items available to everyone. Any additional thoughts?

Kindest regards,

--Nezmar


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Wed Jun 20, 2018 10:44 pm 
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Nezmar wrote:
Several years ago we made an attempt to address the issue you've brought up. In the end, we tried to compromise... we have what we have called "soft limits". Item limits are based upon the total number of player characters. If we had more players, we'd have more "unique" items. This may need some adjustment (though I tend to believe we just need more players), but I think the concept is sound. The adjustments can be made item by item. If everyone gets their friends to play, there will be more items available to everyone. Any additional thoughts?

Kindest regards,

--Nezmar


I understand your point, but MUDs had their heyday in the 90's and have dwindled in popularity ever since. If you look at Distant Land's player base starting from the year 2000 to now, which way has the number gone? It's gone down. DL is unable to compete with games like the Battlefield series, Witcher, Fallout, Overwatch, and all the other thousands of multiplayer games including tabletop games. Now people reading this, including myself, may think to themselves, "Well, I prefer DL to those other games," and that's fine, but we are the minority. Heck, I would even go so far as to say we are the minority of the minority as even mobile gaming is more popular than MUDs.

The point is, DL isn't going to have a surge of new players any time soon. In fact, the inverse is more likely to occur. Does this mean DL is a bad game? No, it just means that the interest isn't there and is unlikely to ever be anything like what it was 18+ years ago. With that said, I think it's wrong to place the onus on us to bring in new players when it's not something we can directly control. There are too many competing interests and a number of annoyances that make DL an unattractive option for people. A constructive dialogue on a number of game changes can be had, but boiling the solution down to "invite your friends" isn't realistic and is extremely unproductive.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 12:05 am 
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I feel like an item purge will only serve as a temporary solution and, in time, the same issues will arise again. The most sensible solution that I've heard so far has been to remove the item limits. Keep the low load rates on unique items, but don't limit how many times they can load. Otherwise we're left with a situation where a few players have a disproportionate percentage of the best items. Purging items that players have worked hard for seems unfair, but it will seem pointless when others load them again only for the cycle to repeat itself.

Just my two cents.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 5:32 pm 
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When Nezmar asked me what I thought about taking the limits off of items I was shocked and asked WHY? He told me that a few had posted here that they thought that would fix the problem. I have read all the posts so far and I would like to include my thoughts.

First as a builder and really at this point the main builder...often times an items has had a limit put on it because that is what the builders intent was for whatever reason. I will use the sword "Decapitator" as an example.. It is a named sword .. should there be more than 1? When the builder of that area made it he/she thought not.

Many limited items are limited because they are more powerful whether that is because of a spell it casts or extra on the affects it was given. So my personal opinion as a player and a builder those items should remain limited.

There are hundreds if not thousands of items that are nearly as powerful as the limited ones.

Currently there are very very few items that are maxed.

I am all for an item and house purge the reason:
Many potions do have limits there are players that may have most of one kind of potion and yet they do not play the game.. they log in religiously once a month to make sure they don't lose the items they have acquired, yet they don't play, why do they need 20 of a single potion?

There are people that have so much stuff honestly I don't think they even realize that they may be holding 5 of a certain item.. they have it in a bag in a bag in a hole in a hole in a tube.. how often do they take the hole out of the tube and then then hole out of the hole and the bag out of the hole and the bag out of the bag and really sort through all the stuff they have.. likely not often.

As a player I was given a lot of items that I was too small for level wise. I held on to it.. as i was able to wear it I passed on the items I removed. I do not keep a separate set of regen EQ, but I understand those that do.

I think that the soft limit is a reasonable solution to the max of items.

I think that there are pluses to having limits personally:
Everyone doesn't look the EXACT same with their EQ
The builders intent (and as a builder I find this one really important... even though many of the areas that have limited items the builders are no longer active in the game)
It increases the value of the items that have limits.

I know that I as a builder would have less incentive to build. If the limits are lifted any building I were to do IF I continued to build would be totally standardized to the level of the mob it loads on. I would place no bonuses, or perks on anything.

Respectfully,
Amaessara


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:02 pm 
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Decapitator is a 2handed battle axe :P.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 8:51 pm 
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As a former builder, I can say that when I would design an item, I tried to keep the strength of the item in proportion with the rarity of the item. Uncapping those items would make them completely overpowered. If we remove the cap on things we'll need to go through and dumb down almost everything in the game (I'm tempted to think that this might need to be done anyways, but I haven't been higher than Hero for probably 5+ years so I really have no legs to stand on here).

I've played games where there's no limitation on the amount an item can load. I don't think I played any of them more than several months because I reached the pinnacle and then became bored.

Distant Lands has kept me coming back off and on for 18 years or so. It must be doing something right, eh?


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:32 pm 
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Amaessara wrote:
When Nezmar asked me what I thought about taking the limits off of items I was shocked and asked WHY? He told me that a few had posted here that they thought that would fix the problem. I have read all the posts so far and I would like to include my thoughts.

First as a builder and really at this point the main builder...often times an items has had a limit put on it because that is what the builders intent was for whatever reason. I will use the sword "Decapitator" as an example.. It is a named sword .. should there be more than 1? When the builder of that area made it he/she thought not.

Many limited items are limited because they are more powerful whether that is because of a spell it casts or extra on the affects it was given. So my personal opinion as a player and a builder those items should remain limited.

There are hundreds if not thousands of items that are nearly as powerful as the limited ones.

Currently there are very very few items that are maxed.

I am all for an item and house purge the reason:
Many potions do have limits there are players that may have most of one kind of potion and yet they do not play the game.. they log in religiously once a month to make sure they don't lose the items they have acquired, yet they don't play, why do they need 20 of a single potion?

There are people that have so much stuff honestly I don't think they even realize that they may be holding 5 of a certain item.. they have it in a bag in a bag in a hole in a hole in a tube.. how often do they take the hole out of the tube and then then hole out of the hole and the bag out of the hole and the bag out of the bag and really sort through all the stuff they have.. likely not often.

As a player I was given a lot of items that I was too small for level wise. I held on to it.. as i was able to wear it I passed on the items I removed. I do not keep a separate set of regen EQ, but I understand those that do.

I think that the soft limit is a reasonable solution to the max of items.

I think that there are pluses to having limits personally:
Everyone doesn't look the EXACT same with their EQ
The builders intent (and as a builder I find this one really important... even though many of the areas that have limited items the builders are no longer active in the game)
It increases the value of the items that have limits.

I know that I as a builder would have less incentive to build. If the limits are lifted any building I were to do IF I continued to build would be totally standardized to the level of the mob it loads on. I would place no bonuses, or perks on anything.

Respectfully,
Amaessara


My original post probably wasn’t very clear. Personally, I’m not advocating one way or another for how items are handled I was purely replying to Nezmar’s comments about how us inviting our friends is going to magically solve our problems. It came off very dismissive. The reality of the situation is that this isn’t 1995 or 2000 anymore and the people who play MUDs will continue to dwindle. The game’s mechanics should undergo changes to reflect that.

That said, there are pros and cons to hard limits and no limits to equipment load rates, but is there a proposed alternatively to discourage hoarding? If the inventory and house purge occurs, what’s to stop players from going out and doing the exact same thing once the items get recirculated into the game? It doesn’t really solve the problem as, in my opinion, you’re just kicking the can further down the road.

Dagroth wrote:
As a former builder, I can say that when I would design an item, I tried to keep the strength of the item in proportion with the rarity of the item. Uncapping those items would make them completely overpowered. If we remove the cap on things we'll need to go through and dumb down almost everything in the game (I'm tempted to think that this might need to be done anyways, but I haven't been higher than Hero for probably 5+ years so I really have no legs to stand on here).

I've played games where there's no limitation on the amount an item can load. I don't think I played any of them more than several months because I reached the pinnacle and then became bored.

Distant Lands has kept me coming back off and on for 18 years or so. It must be doing something right, eh?


I’m a little confused by your post, Dagroth. On one hand you say games with no limitations on gear loads don’t hold your attention, yet at the same time Distant Lands hasn’t held enough of your attention to get beyond Hero status – and it does have equipment limitations. Your post seems a little contradictory.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Thu Jun 21, 2018 10:42 pm 
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I didn't say I've never been above hero status. ;)

Frankly, I just got busy with life. Wife, kids, career, et cetera. I haven't had time to play games much. :)


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Fri Jun 22, 2018 1:12 pm 
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Old player chiming in :)

I haven't been active in quite a while, life is busy. I've also dedicated most of my time to tabletop gaming these days as I run a tabletop cafe so it's work related and fun :P Product knowledge is important plus I enjoy it, but I definitely miss DL and do check in to see how things are going from time to time! I also like to post my 2 cents on positive and negative changes :P

I personally think restricting how much a person can carry is a great way to combat hoarding. No more bags in bags in holes.
I also think a great way to combat hoarding would be to make each extra dimensional item one per person.
That means each person can only have 1 bag of holding, 1 bronze tube, 1 portable hole etc...etc...

I do also like the idea of periodic purges where they're made in advance so you can have a chance to stuff your things in bags, hold said bags, and everything that you're not wearing is purged.
Although if containers were only 1 per character, I don't think this would really be much of an issue.

Most high level avatars are carrying more than they need. Cutting it down a bit sounds like a good idea.

One of a kind items: I always felt items loadable in game should always be loadable. I do understand where "named" swords/weapons should be one of a kind, but one of a kind items with generic names? (The Aura of Ultimate Life) etc... it was just a race for the first person to load it. Then they have it forever. Anybody that joins later can never get it? That did put me off a bit sometimes. I feel as though the BEST items that are beyond anything else and are one of a kind should be roleplayed for, I've always been an advocate that more awesome, powerful items should be given out plentifully during roleplaying. Loading is tedious and less rewarding than items roleplayed for. Although that does create a 2 way work force where staff needs to put in a lot of time to roleplay with the player base.

Roleplayed items could also be done over multiple sessions where the character needs to gather certain materials and needs to put in some real work to see a customized item made for them. That way each avatar isn't a cookie cutter build. Would be super neat if ALL the high level avatars had a unique item or two that set them apart.

Questing - For me, this has always been the biggest drawback of playing regularly. I can't progress unless the staff has the time to run a quest and there's enough players ready to also embark on the quest. I absolutely do love the new system where you can continue to level, but questing allows for multi-classing which is too hard to give up so wait for a quest you must.

I think quests should be automated up to Greater Lord. (Task based premade quests that are unique for each class) That allow you to multi class and get avatar levels. From Lesser Avatar and up, waiting on a staff run quest makes complete sense. Group based task premade quests would also be fantastic, again, only allowed you to progress till Greater Lord using the automated system.

The task system for level 1-99 is AMAZING and I absolutely love it. I wish level 100-199 had an equally rewarding, and adventurous amount of tasks. If I had the time these days, it's something I'd love to build/develop and help work on.

My 2 cents :) DL has astonished me to see the level of growth, continued dedicated of staff and players, and positive changes and new implemented ideas over the years.

Mortius / Alysandir


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Sat Jun 23, 2018 5:33 am 
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As an individual who plays with less frequency these last several years my insight comes from the broader perspective of the whole 15 years that I have known and played.

Over the years I have sat on both sides of the fence of the haves and have-nots. I've borne witness to people with bags in bags, etc and seen things pulled out of containers that made me scratch my head. You can regularly see me use the emote in game when I hop on for my albeit quick play sessions. I've been one to enjoy a simple amount of containers, with two being a nice round number because it fits the role of how much junk I want to be toting around. Now I also understand why individuals might be laden to the gills with an exorbitant amount of items. There's been plenty of times where the best activity I've found myself is what I like to call "level loading". To get that experience for the next set of levels I will go about killing the mobs that could give me the next big thing, or possibly something I could sell, trade, or give to another. If I've loaded that item I would like to savor it because that is one of the few pleasures I get from my playing of this game. Its that dopamine rush of finally after x amount of attempts that garners success.

Now with the idea of purging inventory and houses that raises a question to my mind. If you want to try to slim down the items someone may have on their person with fair warning I don't have an objection with. Yet if you wish to purge the households of the mountains of items that have accumulated from those people a better question would be: Why do we even have the capability to purchase houses? If they're available they will just be used as a dumping ground again and I have seen some houses that look almost like landfills over the years with things on the floor and a multitude of containers stacked up. A better solution to that would be to just maybe condemning the houses until a better function for them to serve could be found.

Then there's the topic of inviting new players to enjoy DL. When I first started playing I dropped the word and showed a few people the fun and excitement I was having with a game that was purely all text. Those people got excited and spread the word to a few more, then a few more and so on. Over the years those people moved onto other things and when asked they had officially closed the chapter on their days with DL. Since then I have brought this up to people in passing and have never been successful in bringing in more players from friends or acquaintances. Even now 15 years later whenever I have brought it up I received at best a dismissive response and at worse they looked at me like I was crazy. I have a hard time trying to find people who even read books let alone play a game where all they do is read and type, heh. I would love to be able to spread the good word, bring in some new blood and freshen up the atmosphere. Doing so would probably get me to come back as more a full time venture than my sporadic visits. Currently its either Dagroth telling me to log on or vice versa.

tl;dr is the inventory purge may help. Get rid of houses or they will get items dumped into them again. I've tried to get more people to play over the last 15 years and nobody in this area is remotely interested in playing a text based game.

Well those are my rambling thoughts on a Saturday morning and only one cup of coffee in my system.

Thank you,
Seraqin and the multitude of other aliases I've had over the years

_________________
Hey dewd, don't be afraid.
You were made to play DL better.
The minute you're in your character's skin.
Then you begin to roleplay better.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Sun Jun 24, 2018 1:32 am 
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Good morning folks, just you friendly Nin bringing forth his thoughts into these rants.

First and foremost, if you have absolutely nothing to collaborate other than your **** ideas of why it isn’t making it, then sincerely **** OFF. I’m not a tolerant person anymore and there is a reason why I’m not an allowed administrator. Mainly because I don’t follow the rules, but more so in terms of the fact I’m not willing to put up with non-constructive bull-malarkey. It takes a lot of effort to streamline things, and good ideas are always welcome; however these days and age I get enough periodical stupidity from Facebook alone without the seemingly erudite-moronic crap some of you seem to spew forth. Which basically translates too – if your argument begins with “well it’s not the same as it ever was,” then I sincerely urge you to look up
‘Same as It Ever Was by the Talking Heads’ (aka. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5IsSpAOD6K8 ). . . Because you may ask yourself, the following questions… ( Jame’s Joyce had nothing on my with the transparent use of ellipses).

Let me just start with I’m a majestic AF stout and true halfling-asshole. I’m more eloquent than you could try to be, and my stature isn’t egotistical enough to **** in your Wheaties this morning to make you feel like the frosted-flake little f*** that you’re. I have no censorship, and I haven’t been absent in over seven plus years of gameplay. Aside from that, I’m more than happy to tell you all of the following in a nutshell because I’m trying to move forth with my newly assumed lesser-status role and still be a part of the game’s active lifestyle. If you’re just coming back to Distant Lands, chances are, you’ve probably run into my efforts to indirectly help your butt get up and going. I want you all to repeat after me; “It’s now about me, it’s about how I can help other people.” Make that your MANTRA, and seriously try to help someone else out other than your character. Because if I’ve learned one thing, it’s how you depend on your friends to get you by in the insane scenarios this game can hurl at you. AND if you read nothing else, your efforts to make this a group mentality shall be the forthcoming of the Second Wave.

NOW, let’s get on to the points I’ve been so eagerly wanting to discuss, because there are some of you who still confide in me your whims and angsts with the game. This is awesome, since I’m going to try and utilize those desires as a passion to manifest something internal within the game’s mechanics….
Step back from your high-pony for a moment and actually realize changes are happening and that you’ve probably not said thanks to Nezmar and Amaessara lately, as well Baasha for setting this iteration up with a stoic impact…
SO, back to the main topic at hand… my little pretty-pretty ponies,

A) Quests:

Although it appears the game is on top of this issue as far and trying to keep active players with the ability of a quest being viable, I feel as it has been brought to my attention, that a lot of the reluctance to return or play is brought forth by the fact of the stagnant waiting times. So I’ve proposed the idea of having automated quests into play. Which means you can probably join a task-based quest and obtain your next bracket avatar-status without the need of scheduling time out of your lives. It’ll be some time before developed, but since it’s a concern it seemed only appropriate to mention that this is something I wanted to propose.

B) Class based skills – the main derivative of my wanting to append to the current conversation.

I feel like we can utilize the game’s current mechanics to sort of begin to fledge out the lack thereof of content for making each class unique. However, this isn’t a chance to just mention a cool idea that’s underdeveloped. I think we can all collaborate on the classes we’re playing and help make the upper echelon skill base something more interesting. Please try to utilize the following as a rubric for coming up with helpful ideas.

1) As a ninja, I compete with the monks on a regular basis. But I realized that maybe we should try to add some active skills that let them become a class in their own right. For example, Paladins and Rangers have a Macros based stance and posture ability. Paladins specifically have a skill called INSPIRE. These skills all have a “cooldown” method as to when a player can activate them. So for a monk let us dream upon the idea that.

1A) A monk’s ability to stun is dependent on their straight-classing their main class. As tested these levels cap out at 200 during the DLDS’s. So, if a person spends their first guild-lore talisman at 100 to got 150 Monk, lets add a few active skills for their first 25 levels, so-on and so-forth. At 145’ish maybe they get a skill called AGRESSION. Poor naming choice, but this skill will mimic the INSPIRE duration for a few prompts, increase their attack ratio of to mimic the SPEED spell.

Since their stun is directly related to their main-class level to stun, then let us keeping adding skills through each talisman gained. So that straight classing isn’t something that gets 0 Bonus.

For example:
LVL 175 MONK Skills
a) Submissive Combat: Again on a cool down type skill, this will increase a Monk’s chance to stun against even a higher level mob.
b) Vampiric Grasp: Hits can regain the health of the damage inflicted.
c) Some sort of defense that’s activated that increase certain RIS features.

Again, each of these skills are just suggestions that I want to see snowballed upon. It kind of requires of an understanding of the game’s inner structure which most of you don’t have. But each class can have an addition to their skills plus unlocked skills when you’ve multi-classed.

Originally I was told that the class combo’s would unlock certain skills set aside from your choice of obtaining certain tiers. However, the idea was underdeveloped and has a huge potential.

Just move onto a mage again for another example. At level 150’ish mage maybe we should have a macros-cool-down skill that works like this.

Arcane Candle – A marbled solitary wax candle is created by the mage in the room they’re standing. The candle gives a +3 the arcane focus. Thus, the mage can cast more damaging spells in the room for a brief period of time.

The idea is that each class can utilize these macros-based enhancements, but we need to sort of collaborate per class ahead of time to ask Nezmar for something that’s concrete and not just a concept half-conceived.

I WOULD LIKE to reserve a whole post for the ideas that I’ve come up with and see if anyone else would like to elaborate. So within the next few days I’ll actually type out my ideas.

C) Unrestricted grouping.

I think this issue has already changed lately, but I’ve noticed we’re not taking chances with lower levels because of our grouping requirements being ½ the level of the party we want to group with. Since we’re working with only so many online at once, it’s imperative that we all remain capable of helping one another out. I mean, I join Laqmar as much as possible to level easier, but that’s because I’m in the level range of his avatar status. Allowing all levels to be groups is important. No matter if it changes the charmed NPC dynamic drastically.
D) Game Content.
We’re all focused on having something new to enjoy. But for the most part, especially as one of the people teaching peoples how to get places, I notice that the current things aren’t readily enjoyed. Not everything can be expanded or expounded upon, so that means we need to revamp the idea of how to make existent content more usable. Sadly, this may require some building of tasks in zones already established to have people enjoying places already on the map. Those being the case, when you level somewhere or read the room descriptions, try to keep in mind small story arcs that could be utilized for tasks. The more collaboration on this front the better the game will grow. Sure we can’t all learn to build tasks, but we can utilize or daydreams to add content to places.

For examples:
1) The priesthood could have a ghost trying to invade the priestesses and require them needing help to rid the place through some sort of exorcism.
2) Dumagat could have flying fire-lizards terrorizing the village and need some vanquishing.
3) The tureen sewers could have rat’s nest causing a damn in the sewage and need some janitorial services.
4) The centaur village where Grimble-Grumble lives could have a meteor fall into the village that’s causing an unnatural illness which needs curing.
5) Kandaria’s bath house could be haunted by a Bannik and need someone to rid the problem.
6) Zorath’s castle could have a spy that needs assassinated.

This is basically a call for in zone task creation, and the more content we all see and collaborate upon, the more of a busy-body game interface that can exist. But expecting 2 Builders to do all the work is absurd.

E) Mortal Group Abilites and Avatar Multi-Classing Skills.

One of my biggest joys is grouping with Laqmar some mornings. We complement one another. His barbarism with my ninja-tactics… This leads me to believe that there should be group ability skills that appear when two different classes group together. For example if a mage and druid team up, maybe they could create a Natural Monsum golem that one of them could control to help with combat. Unlike the mage’s typical monsums, the golem could have a special RIS setting that enables certain combat situations to their advantage.

A mage and assassin could create a spell enhanced backstab that fires off mid-combat for another chance of asssasinte.
Rangers/Druid could make a higher damaging focus spell that reflects a meshing of the two classes abilities.

Basically, what we’re looking at is a “cool down” type ability that only is available when two PC’s are grouped and working together. A typical blending of the two classes abilities.

This is an idea that I feel like only I’ve entertained, but I don’t feel like it’s something impossible to ask for.

F) Elemental Focus Abilities.
Since we’ve already created Arcane, Illusion, Musical, and Divine Focus maybe we can work together and build an elemental attribute that works through exhaustion and posture/stance macro-like abilities. For example, when you’re shooting a bow maybe we could shoot fire, earth, wind, or air type of chakra arrows. Each one having it’s +’s and –“s to a dependant MOB RIS status.

G) I shall elaborate further on some of my ideas when I’m not exhausted for the evening.. I feel like a lot of injustice has been served during this post’s creation. Albeit, maybe it will help others actively participate.


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 Post subject: Re: Wanted feedback on scheduled item purges
PostPosted: Mon Jun 25, 2018 11:28 am 
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Back to a much needed discussion. As I understand the avatar system the max on your level through talismans is going to peak at 200. When you hit 100 your essentially start at 125. Through the advancement of 3 talismans you could hit the 200 level mark at 175.

Master-list of classes: Assassin, Barbarian, Bard, Cavalier, Cleric, Druid, Illusionist, Mage, Monk, Ninja, Paladin, Thief, Warrior (13)
So let’s break this down per class starting with the four main umbrellas.
Cleric -
150 – Advanced Animation – A skill that creates a new type of zombies that are a higher level than their current basic ones. Let these be learned types that can wield and utilize skills. As to which type of classes they are would be mercenary types and not spell-casting ones. So maybe assassins, warriors, and perhaps thieves would enable the cleric to utilize a few skill commands through the order channels.

Stasis – a cool down exhausting macros that enables a cleric to make a room temporarily (!combat) for the chance of healing party members, getting them recalled, or trying to change the odds. This skill should be usable mid combat and be seen as sort of a life-saver. Being so it should have a lengthier cool-down than the exodus of postures or stances.

Ungodly Hexing – I see a lot of people still utilizing gear as a means to take some mobs down. Why not just create a spell that lowers Strength and Dexterity by -5, makes the stopping of the target go down 2-4 stopping points, and has the potential to negate their RIS-like defenses across the board. Rather than this just be a spell, it could be an attempt macros skill like INSPIRE is and be used periodically.

Imbued Deity Blessing of Items – Similar an enchant weapon spell, but on a timer for a period of time. The weapon blessed will reflect a strict alignment-usage of a weapon in regards to the caster. Make the duration for maybe an entire 24 hours (game-time, not in real life). Maybe it should just be a +6 to hitroll since divine intervention could be seen as a means of making sure one’s mark was true.

175 – Advanced Sanctuary – Look I get it, everyone wants to think sanctuary is a game changer, but perhaps there should be an upper version of this spell. One that involves more of the RIS type of immunities and an increased resilience to damage type attacks. Perhaps this version could also work to counter some spell damage, but maybe that’s making it a bit too extreme.

Word of God – At this level clerics are utilizing a few damage spells with their divine focus 5, but why not give them an area spell that also taps into the focus damage potential. This type of spell casting doesn’t discriminate against alignment types, since I mean the cleric is a harbinger of their god’s will and even if you’re a like-alignment doesn’t mean you can’t be punished by a god’s instrument.

Glob of Ascension Creation – So, it’s pretty obvious that the healing types are doing awesome, and trying to factor in a new type of healing isn’t my goal. But since globs of ascension already exist why not
make it possible through a cool-down effect for a cleric to spend the same 200 mana or so for a full heal and allow them an ability to create a glob that will heal everyone in the party. I mean maybe it should just heal the party members of a group, but combined with the stasis skill it could make the cleric role even more badass.
200- Esoteric Conjuring – By this point if I was a cleric I’d hope to have an ability to conjure some sort of mythical or elemental undead to use to my help. Not so much another humanoid zombie, but perhaps some flying creature that I could also mount. The esoteric conjuring should be limited to 1 like an elemental, but be capable of self-replicating healing (I guess like the platinum ring healing macros, where it heals itself every so often.) Also it should automatically dissolve once its timer runs out and the cleric who casted it should have a period of mana-degen placed on them until it hits the cool down point.
Occultist Recharge – Piggybacking on the state of the advanced animation zombie’s, this skill would let the cleric utilize the zombie’s as a mana-battery of sorts. The NPC’s would need to be in the prayer position for this skill to be utilized, but it would allow the cleric to zap the zombie’s mana base as his/her own. I’ve seen how the bash lag has kept me from making my charmies stand up. So perhaps we could make it that the zombies can’t stand for a solid four minutes after this skill is used as they “won’t heed your command,” type of modifier.
Thieves
150 – Combat Thievery - A new skill that works in tandem with steal itself, while you normally can’t steal something from someone in a fight, this skill would just enable to a thief to utilize the marginal time a NPC or PC is busy to get away with their loot.

Key-Creation – I don’t really think this one is possible unless there is a way to make an item to possess a similar vnum as the key needed to unlock a gate. But It would be nice for a thief to be able to make a “replica” !rent key that could be handed off to someone else. Thus I’ll just append this idea here.

Focus Stabbing – I didn’t conceive this idea for thief alone, but perhaps inclusive to any class that backstabs as a mortal. It will be more of a complimentary skill for the multi-classing verse. But whatever focus skill a player has, this passive skill would randomly initiate and increase the typical backstab with a bit of magical damage. It should only work in an increase in relation with the level of FOCUS the player has a skill level at.

Blending – Think your premier hide and sneak skill. One that can’t be detected by any of the sights spells. The only drawback is this skill only works for the room you’ve utilized it in and should have a exhaust timer on it as well. Since any thief straight classing to the point won’t have a healing mechanism, this skill will enable them to rest and rover in peace in the worst of areas without the fear of dying while regenerating.

175 – Advance Pilfering – Pilfer is a great skill, but I do feel like it calls upon certain treasure types. Perhaps an advanced skill that activates a few of the upper-level treasure types would be an incentive for taking more talismans under this class.

Espionage Whispering – Again not a skill I think is plausible, but it comes to my mind because it was once talked about being able to make a mob that isn’t aggressive, aggressive. God that sounds weird when you type it out. Anyways, this is another cool-down skill that doesn’t always execute successfully. But a thief has a chance of making a NPC attack other NPC’s around him/her. Would make it easier for the thief to utilize combat thievery is needed.

Lock Creation – I can’t figure out on the frequency of being able to forge a lock. I like the idea of once per reboot. And every subsequent lock made by the thief will have the same item # and vnum for the key. Meaning, every lock that the PC makes will be unlockable by that pervious key. I’d like to restrict it to just containers being lock by this trap like mechanism. But again this skill is just in the sketches of my “is it a capable and viable” skill.

200 - Double Backstab – A thief when dual wielding can land two successful backstabs for one. Seems kind of ridiculous, but at this point in their game career, they’re going to need some serious advantages to killing NPCs.
Bash Defense – This is perhaps the one class that I think is more of a coward than a person that wants to be in a fight. So giving them a passive skill that has a chance to work when bashed to flee seems like an advantage. At 175, (the minimal level this skill could be unlocked by a thief,) I don’t see how they’d survive a fight if they got their *** knocked on the ground. The defense would just automatically set the PC and crawling and flee them out of the room, where they’ll still suffer the bash-prompt-lag before the can get a chance to secure their persons. Still they should automatically go into a hiding state when crawling, because that’s what these delinquents are good at, scurrying off into the shadows.

Group Sneak/Hide – This skill will enable the thief to lead his/her group members through an area while they’re all hiding.

I’m taking a break at this point to finish fledging these ideas out, but I’m going to leave the rubric in case any second to third parties want to start trying to collaborate. Plus I’m probably going to need help understanding the Umbrella Talisman Classes as I call them (UTC). The cross-classing abilities are something that will follow after the initial straight classing ideas are settled. Mainly because I see the limitless possibility of unique skills through minor cross-classing and the need to add unique skills that complement each choice of growth a player takes.


Warrior
150 -
175 -
200 -
Mage
150 -
175 -
200 -

Then onto the subclass umbrellas.
Cleric – Druid
Warrior – Cavalier, Ranger, Barbarian, Paladin
Thief – Assassin, Bard, Ninja
Mage – Illusionist


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